Sounds Fake But Okay
Sounds Fake But Okay
Ep 302: Are Kids Growing Up Faster? Ruminations on the impact of the internet
Hey what's up hello! This week we talk about the effects the internet has on how kids age and develop. We try to decipher why it feels like kids are growing up faster and getting sexualized younger.
Content Notice: sexualization of minors, pedophilia, sexual assault, school shooting, nazis
Episode Transcript: www.soundsfakepod.com/transcripts/are-kids-growing-up-faster-ruminations-on-the-impact-of-the-internet
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[00:00:00]
SARAH: Hey, what's up, hello! Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro ace girl. I'm Sarah, that's me.
KAYLA: And a bi demisexual girl, that's me Kayla.
SARAH: Talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else we just don't understand.
KAYLA: On today's episode, Growing Up Faster.
BOTH: Sounds Fake But Okay.
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod.
KAYLA: Hi.
SARAH: Hi. How's everyone?
KAYLA: Did you know we have a new cactus in our lives?
SARAH: You do.
KAYLA: Dear listener?
SARAH: At Kayla's house.
KAYLA: Some of you who have been around for a long time, or have artificially made yourselves be around a long time by listening to the catalog, will know of Todd
SARAH: Cactalog
KAYLA: Cactalog, will know of Todd, Sarah's college cactus that lived much too long and looked a lot like a penis.
SARAH: And is now thriving in Wisconsin.
KAYLA: Yeah, is now thriving and still looks weird.
SARAH: Still looks weird, but has really expanded.
KAYLA: In a different way. Yeah
SARAH: Yeah. In a different way
KAYLA: Yeah. He's thriving. I have a cactus now because I decided that that was something I was going to do.
SARAH: Midlife crisis?
KAYLA: Shh. In a very real way that we don't need to talk about.
SARAH: Oops
KAYLA: Hello, wow. And I was just showing… what did I name it? Oh, Susan Serrated Knife?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: My cactus. And I was just showing her to Sarah because there are some spots on it and I have historically like a black thumb. So I’m also… it’s so wiggly, you are seeing this?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: What’s that about?
SARAH: But you don't want to pack her in too tight either.
KAYLA: I know that she was too tightly packed when I first got her. So, I think she has expanded.
SARAH: So, are her pronouns she/it?
KAYLA: Yeah. Yes.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: Yeah. She's very modern that way.
SARAH: All right. Cool.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Happy Mother's Day for those of you who are not in the UK.
KAYLA: Thank you. I am a mother.
SARAH: Those in the UK, fuck off, you already had yours and there was a whole drama around it surrounding the royal family.
KAYLA: Oh. Oh.
SARAH: That was because that was the day that they released the doctored picture because it was Mother's Day.
KAYLA: Oh. Oh, it is not funny, but it is a little bit
SARAH: Because they have a different one but…
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Anyway.
KAYLA: Anyway. Happy… It was already my birthday to me.
SARAH: So true. It's almost Kayla's birthday in this time.
KAYLA: That’s for you
SARAH: It's already Kayla's birthday in your time.
KAYLA: It already happened. I'm 27.
SARAH: Seven.
KAYLA: Seven. Exactly.
SARAH: 100 years old.
KAYLA: Yep.
SARAH: All right. So, before Kayla has to stew in that for too long, shall we do a podcast?
KAYLA: We shall. Here's my prediction for this episode. Sarah and I are both not at peak performance this evening.
SARAH: Yeah. I've performed better.
KAYLA: I too have done that. And so…
SARAH: I've performed worse. But…
KAYLA: Sure, oh, haven’t we all? So, my prediction for this is sometimes when we're in this state, we have episodes where things feel really shitty for 30 minutes, and I'm like, this is not a good episode. And then right at the end, I'll be like, oh, we actually said some profound shit. It's too bad we didn't plan more or that could have been what we said originally at the beginning. So that's what I'm expecting from this episode, just to get everyone on the same page.
SARAH: I think I am not in as negative a state as you are.
KAYLA: Mm. I would hope not. Christ.
SARAH: But I am in a bit of a rush.
KAYLA: Sure. So, you're saying we should get started maybe?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Okay. That's fine, I guess. I just want to share my feelings with you, but it's fine. We can do that some other day.
SARAH: I'm just saying it's going to impact the vibe of the episode.
KAYLA: No, we can…
SARAH: What you're bringing to the table, and that's what I'm bringing to the table.
KAYLA: And this is what you're bringing to the table. No, thank you for your openness and your honesty. That's beautiful, actually.
SARAH: I'm getting on a plane tomorrow and I have not packed a single thing.
KAYLA: And we're all shocked about it, too, is the thing. Let's begin.
SARAH: Kayla, what are we talking about this week?
KAYLA: I don't really know, man.
SARAH: Fuck if I know. Okay.
KAYLA: Fuck if I know. It's Sarah's idea. She's steering this ship. Sarah, what are we talking about this week?
SARAH: Mother hecker. Okay, on the tweet machine, on a recent day that was today, I saw a tweet where it was a video of a girl from Instagram, and she's like a kid, and she was doing a “Get Ready With Me.” And during that “Get Ready With Me,” she was talking about her, quote, love life.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: Oh, indeed. And the caption on this, because obviously it was someone else who had, like, ripped it and cross posted it. The caption was, “we're genuinely so doomed. What do you mean love life?”
KAYLA: Mm. How old are we thinking this girl was?
SARAH: I'm bad at gauging, but the comments seem to think nine.
KAYLA: Oh, okay, worse than I expected.
SARAH: I don’t know. But I watched the video, and she was just doing daily makeup. It wasn't crazy.
KAYLA: Sure
SARAH: And she was talking about this boy who she had got his Snapchat, and they had been talking for a little over a month, but then she found out that he had a crush on this other girl, and this other girl's the opposite of her. And so, she needs to figure out...
KAYLA: Oh, no. You know the best thing to do?
SARAH: What?
KAYLA: Is you both go up to him and you say, pick one of us
SARAH: Pick one
KAYLA: That's how the children used to do it back in our day.
SARAH: I certainly never did that
KAYLA: I never did that, but I… it was a cultural moment.
SARAH: That’s something you would do
KAYLA: I didn't. Excuse you. But I've heard of this happening.
SARAH: But basically, she's just talking about this boy, she has a crush on him and how he has a crush on someone else, and how she's wondering if maybe she has any chance or not. And everyone was like, “oh my God, we're doomed. I can't believe these kids are doing this.” And I was genuinely confused by this, because to me that did not read as any different from any other kid who is a little bit older doing the exact same thing.
KAYLA: Sure
SARAH: Like a 12-year-old kid, that seems to me like one of those things that a 12-year-old kid would do, and I would find weird, I would be like, “the allos are at it again, society has made them think that this is what they have to do.”
KAYLA: True
SARAH: And so, it was so interesting to me that because of, I don't know, a couple years age difference, the internet was like, “this is wrong,” compared to the exact same thing, which is what I think they… you know, if she were a couple years older, they would be saying, “oh yeah, haha, that's so cute.” Like, she's just, you know, I did that when I was her, like, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And there was some discussion in the comments about why it was upsetting. Part of it was, I mean, she was doing like, just like, makeup at nine years old. And like, it wasn't like crazy makeup, but like, the fact that a nine-year-old is like doing a “Get Ready With Me.” She had like the headband that everyone has.
KAYLA: Oh, of course
SARAH: Some people were upset about the fact that she talked about having a Snapchat because they were like, “she's nine.”
KAYLA: Sure
SARAH: And then some people were just upset about her talking about like, referring to it as her love life. And then also, there was some concern about the fact that like, she's posting these videos online, like, is her account monitored by her parents, like, that kind of stuff. And I think those are all valid concerns. I just… I was a little bit baffled by how strong the response was, because I didn't expect it.
KAYLA: Yeah, it's interesting, because to me, I don't know how new any of this is, like…
SARAH: It's not
KAYLA: Like think about when we were nine, right? like, we all were, you know, playing pretend acting like we were older as kids. That's like what you do.
SARAH: That’s what kids do
KAYLA: You act like you're… yeah, you act like your school teacher, you act like a nurse, right, you act like your older sister, whatever. The thing is, it just we didn't post it on the internet, because we didn't have that.
SARAH: Right. Or like you would post a very poor-quality video on YouTube, and no one would ever watch it.
KAYLA: No, exactly. So, like, to me, it's kind of like, I… clearly this girl… like this is the content that's online right now, right? Is you have influencer girls, they're doing a “Get Ready With Me.” And they're talking about like, whatever the drama is in their life. Like that's just a very popular content format.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: So, it's like, okay, yeah, if you're a kid, and your parents allow you to have access to the internet, that is likely something you're going to see unless you're like restricted to only like kids content.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Which like, I don't even know how that's possible anymore. So, it's like, yeah, obviously, you're going to see that. And then she's a kid, she's going to imitate that, like, that's just what happens. I think the bigger concern would be then like, yeah, should she be on the internet this young? Like, are her parents monitoring her? And I think that gets into much more…
SARAH: Should the comments be on?
KAYLA: Yes. I think that gets into a much more valid conversation of like, when should kids be getting phones? When should they be getting internet access? What kind of internet access should they get? Like, that's just unprecedented territory. You know, like when we were kids, we were like chained to the desktop. And so, there was like, very clear restrictions on what was going on or like, we had like, my parents had rules of like, no phones when you go to bed, you know, so it's like, you couldn't be just like doing weird stuff with no one around, you know? But things are just very different now.
[00:10:00]
SARAH: Yeah. And it's really interesting looking at the replies. There's one that has 15,000 likes that says, “she looks nine, no way her parents don't have some sort of play in this WTF.” What do you… are you saying that…
KAYLA: Play in what?
SARAH: I think they're trying to say that her parents are like trying to use her to get attention.
KAYLA: I hope not.
SARAH: I also hope not because that is a genuine problem. But…
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: You more often see that in like family vlogger scenarios, like, it seems like she's just imitating the big kids like that. It seems like that's exactly what she's doing. And she wants to post it because that's what the big kids do.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: And she wants to act like she's older than she is, because that's what kids do.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And then there's a response that has 11,000 likes that says, “her mom manages her Instagram account” like one tear face. And I'm like, that's probably better than the alternative. Like you can have beef with her about how she's managing it. And that's totally fair, but
KAYLA: Yeah, I mean, yeah, I guess I don't know exactly what that comment is insinuating. Because I think obviously it's a good thing her mom is monitoring it. If I were her mom, would I let her post that kind of content? I don't know.
SARAH: Yeah. But then you also have a question of like, at what point does being like, “no, you absolutely cannot do this,” encourage them to…
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: You know, you have to find the right balance.
KAYLA: It's a hard thing. Because it's like, at what age is it acceptable question mark for your child to start like engaging in romantic activities…
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Is one thing that I don't know how that is determined. I don't know, but it's another to be like, “at what point is it okay to post on the internet for safety reasons?”
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Because if you are a young girl posting that kind of content, there's going to be some fucking creeps in the comments. And like, it sucks that that's the precaution we have to take and that you can't just post whatever you want freely. But like, that would be my main concern is not that those are the activities she's going about because she's, you know, she's a kid like you said, she's imitating the big kids. She has a little crush, like, from what I understand, having a crush as a nine-year-old is normal, I guess
SARAH: Apparently, people can
KAYLA: I had my first crush in fifth or sixth grade. How old is that?
SARAH: Ten?
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Eleven?
KAYLA: That was like my first ever crush. And I did nothing about it, obviously
SARAH: Of course
KAYLA: So, it's… yeah.
SARAH: There's a response that has 20,000 likes that says, “her doing a full face of makeup broke my heart,” which… I was a little baffled by how many likes that had because yes, she is doing like, quote unquote, a full face of makeup. But it's also not extra like it's… it's like a natural looking makeup look like it's…
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And I'm like, why do you… like, it's such a fine line between like, why do you care? And also, like, you don't want to be like making these girls feel like they have to grow up too fast and be adults too fast.
KAYLA: Yes, see, that's the hard line for me. It's like, yeah, a, that's like not your kid, that's not your business. Why do you care? But I do, on the other hand, understand the concern of like, if girls start wearing makeup too early, are they going to just like, is that going to just tank your self-esteem later and you feel like you can't not wear makeup without being ugly? You know, like that…
SARAH: Is that something that you're doing for fun because you enjoy it or because you feel like you have to? Yeah.
KAYLA: Yeah. I also think makeup is another like odd moment that like not many other generations can relate to because from what I understand of makeup, like before the early 2000s, like, makeup was just like not accessible, like drugstore makeup was not a thing like, there were just was not a wide variety of makeup, people did not know how to do it well, because there were not like YouTube videos. So, like, when people post videos of like…
SARAH: Like starting to wear makeup would be like some mascara and a lip gloss. Like it…
KAYLA: Right. Exactly.
SARAH: It wasn’t that big of a thing.
KAYLA: Yeah. So, it's like, when people post pictures of like, “oh, here's what I looked like in middle school. And here's what middle schoolers look like right now.” Like they're… “I looked fucked up and weird and like, they look pretty.” It's like, yes, but also, there's so much more access to that kind of thing right now. And like, again, I do see problems with that. Like I do think it's unfortunate if girls grow up, like they're very young and already feeling like I need to put this on to look pretty or like feel good about myself.
SARAH: Yeah. And in response to that comment about like, “her doing a full-face makeup breaks my heart,” there's a comment that says, “these comments broke my heart even more.” Some people are also commenting that they're invested in her love life.
KAYLA: Weird
SARAH: And this is a weird one being like, “snap me” and then they give their snap. And they're like, “love those pants. Do you wish he was juicy with you?”
KAYLA: What?
SARAH: And then somebody said, “lil gyat but it's all right.” And then someone responded, “oh, maybe because she's just a kid.” And so, in response to the guy being like snap me, like someone responded and added her parents and said block this man from your daughter's account. Like he follows a bunch of children is clearly a predator
KAYLA: Yucky.
SARAH: And so, like that is obviously a problem. But…
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: If your kid wants to have an Instagram, you can set it so that the only people that can comment are people that they follow.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: You could do that
KAYLA: Yeah, that's really hard because it's like, I don't know, man, I wish they had social media that was like, just for kids. Because like…
SARAH: It's called… what's that penguin…
KAYLA: Club penguin?
SARAH: Club penguin
KAYLA: I don't think that exists anymore.
SARAH: I think it does. I don't think kids use it. I think adults use it.
KAYLA: I think it's people our age. Because it's like, if it was other nine-year-olds seeing that then they could be like, you know, having nine-year-old conversations about it.
SARAH: Right. The problem is that's…
KAYLA: But that’s not what… That's not what's happening.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Like they just need that… their own…
SARAH: Segregation
KAYLA: Place where they can be little.
SARAH: The only other comment on this particular thing that I want to mention is something that I also thought of where someone said, “you should delete this. It's maybe weird, but I feel like this is opening her up to a larger audience more hate and more creeps.” Because they just posted this video, it includes her @, it shows her face.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: It has… now I don't trust the way Twitter counts views, but supposedly 11 million views.
KAYLA: Sure.
SARAH: So, it's like, yeah, maybe you shouldn't have done that.
KAYLA: Yeah. I mean, I get wanting to like do commentary on it, but you could have like, tried to like hide the @ or like…
SARAH: You could have just censored something…
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Yeah. But this all kind of led to a conversation that we're going to have right here on this podcast about basically the way that the internet has impacted kids feeling like they need to grow up fast and the ways in which they are able to grow up fast and the ways in which sexualization kind of plays into that.
KAYLA: Yeah. I was thinking about this earlier and I feel like when we were in like middle and high school and granted, like we had smartphones then, you know, but there wasn't…
SARAH: It wasn't middle school. I didn't have a smartphone.
KAYLA: I did
SARAH: There was someone in my class that had an iPhone 3G and she had an ombre pink and purple case and it was so cool.
KAYLA: I bet it was. Yeah. I did not have a smartphone until I was like 16 or 17. Anyway, all that to say, we had social media and all of that, but it kind of felt like the way trends got passed down was from like older siblings. It would be like these are the kids who have siblings that are in college or like a couple grades above and like that's how you figure out what's like cool
SARAH: What’s cool
KAYLA: And what's going on and like how to act older because like that's what you had access to or like my cousins from wherever, you know, whatever
SARAH: Or like you start high school and you're a freshman and you're like, “what are the seniors doing?” Like, “what are they wearing?” Like, you know?
KAYLA: Yeah. But now I think TikTok especially, like there's just so much more access to what like a 30-year-old's day to day is like that a child would never have had access to that information before unless it's like their aunt.
SARAH: It also goes in the other direction, too, where it's like it also allows them to develop their own like Gen Alpha culture that's consistent.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: And so, it's like one thing can kind of bleed into a whole generation of kids through the Internet. And so, if it's a good thing, then it's a good thing. If it's a neutral thing, okay. But if it's a bad thing.
KAYLA: Yeah. It has been very interesting watching like Gen Alpha's development so far. And I was just thinking about this earlier...
SARAH: Skibbity
KAYLA: Skibbity toilet or whatever. Yeah.
SARAH: Skibbity, only they understand that.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Only they
KAYLA: Yeah. I don't know. I haven't looked it up. I don't know. But I was thinking of it earlier from like a marketing perspective, because I remember when we were growing up, it was all like millennials, millennials. What are they doing?
SARAH: Silly bands
KAYLA: How do we sell to them? Yes. And so, like growing up, I was like, oh, well, I'm a millennial because no one was talking about Gen Z. And then only in the last couple of years, I feel like people have been like, oh, we have to figure out what Gen Z is up to.
[00:20:00]
SARAH: I think that's part of the reason why I've always identified so strongly with being a millennial, even though I am more of a millennial cusper. And there are a lot of people my age who do firmly identify with Gen Z is because growing up…
KAYLA: It just like wasn't an identity.
SARAH: Yeah. I was just like growing up, I was like, “oh, I'm a 90s kid. I'm a millennial.”
KAYLA: Yeah. But I feel like people are already talking about Gen Alpha like they are already being like classified as like this cultural group much faster. Like when we were Gen Alpha's age, we were still being called millennials. You know?
SARAH: Yeah. The delineation for the exact year will probably not come out until they're more like high school/college age. But like there is… you can tell there's a difference.
KAYLA: Yes. It's very clear.
SARAH: It's because…
KAYLA: It's the Minecraft kids.
SARAH: Truly. I don't understand Minecraft.
KAYLA: Roblox. It's the Roblox kids.
SARAH: That is true. Roblox.
KAYLA: Don't get it.
SARAH: I don't even understand what it is in all honesty.
KAYLA: Me neither.
SARAH: And that's because we're fucking old.
KAYLA: Old. Old.
SARAH: But that is like the major result of the internet is you have access to everything. Everyone has access to everything. And so, trends spread more quickly. They mutate and evolve more quickly. Much like diseases. And like it's… as you said like we got information on like trends and what's cool from like older siblings and like whatever. But we also got it through like TV. And the time it takes for something to get to TV to get to you takes longer.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Whereas on the internet like you can upload something like that.
KAYLA: Even thinking about like early internet too like early YouTube, I think it all verged like pretty kid friendly. Like you see… I feel like I've seen a lot of…
SARAH: David after dentist.
KAYLA: I don't know what that is.
SARAH: David after dentist?
KAYLA: What is that?
SARAH: Not just the most famous YouTube video that ever was.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: David after dentist.
KAYLA: Oh. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. I know David after dentist. Yes.
SARAH: Thank you.
KAYLA: But I'm thinking of like YouTubers. Right? Like I’ve seen a lot of…
SARAH: Once youtube-ing became a thing, yeah
KAYLA: Yes. There's this lady I like know of her peripherally. I don't think I've ever watched one of her videos but it's like Laura DIY or whatever.
SARAH: Laura DIY. Yeah.
KAYLA: Yes. And so, she like within the last couple of years rebranded to be like I'm a fucking adult.
SARAH: I'm an adult now. Yeah.
KAYLA: Because she just like… it's like, you remember when we were younger and it was like the back-to-school videos like 30-year-olds would be like, “here's a back-to-school haul.”
SARAH: Oh, yeah, Bethany Mota?
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Bethany Mota, fucking Ingrid Nilsen, who's now living her best life with a fucking candle company
KAYLA: Exactly.
SARAH: Meredith Foster, I watched those girlies
KAYLA: And I love that for you. But it's like you know like, even the older people were skewing younger. I don't think they were being like I got fucked up last night. Let's…
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Talk about it
SARAH: They were like, this is what people watch like even if even if I'm in college now like yeah, I'll do like a back-to-school because like I'm going back to school too like.
KAYLA: Yeah. And now you have like the Alex Earls or like the call her daddies of the world who are like here's my hangover get ready with me, I had 25 shots last night and I peed in my outfit and here's what it looks like, and it's like, okay
SARAH: I think part of it is because we're the generation that grew up with like YouTubers being cool and like so now that we have gotten older we still view that as cool. And so, we want to make it adult and make it align with how old we are.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But then it just means that there's more content that's like less kid-friendly. But then again if you think about back in the day there were a lot of like YouTubers who would do like drinking challenges and that sort of thing when their audience was primarily kids.
KAYLA: That's fair.
SARAH: It just wasn't sexual necessarily or not overtly so.
KAYLA: Yeah. And it's like… it's not like I think it's wrong that people are making that kind of content, right? Like I think overall as long as the algorithm is not biased which we know it is, but in a world where the algorithm was not biased that allows people to see a much more diverse range of people than they would likely be able to see in their real lives. So, like in certain ways it's really good, right? Like there are people that I've seen on TikTok, I've watched their “days in my life” and I've like learned about their life. I would never have interacted with someone like that in real life. But then the algorithm is biased so it's like I'm… it's just going to serve me white people unless I'm like really doing like my best to sway it which is not how it should work, but anyway
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, it's like… it's not like that content is wrong, it's just then like what…
SARAH: Echo chamber
KAYLA: Do you do with the children.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Like what as a parent… and again, we've said this before, neither of us are parents I don't know what the right decision for these things is, I don't know that current parents know what you're supposed to do, but…
SARAH: I am so glad that we grew up before like iPhones were a thing.
KAYLA: Same.
SARAH: Like so glad.
KAYLA: Same. Seems stressful.
SARAH: Yeah, I… Facebook recently reminded me of a memory…
KAYLA: Of?
SARAH: Of I was sharing my second semester schedule in high school, I believe I was in…
KAYLA: Those were the days
SARAH: I think I was in ninth grade and it was a screenshot from my iPod touch and just the graphics where I was like, “oh my God, it's 2012.”
KAYLA: No sometimes I look back at like my old Instagram or my old Facebook and I'm like, “what were we doing?”
SARAH: I was like who has classes with me and I really seriously considered sharing it again and being like, “guys who has classes with me?”
KAYLA: “Guys who has classes with me?” My favorite was like, “do you have A, B or C lunch? what lunch do you have?”
SARAH: Yeah, ours was first, second and third lunch but like I get it.
KAYLA: Okay. Anyway
SARAH: But I just… yeah, I think because there's so much access to everything that means that kids get… and on one hand that's really good because queer kids can see queer people
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: They can see people who are like them and experience things in the same way that they do even if those groups and communities are not available to them where they live, that's fucking great, but they can also put you in echo chambers and fucking radicalize you and turn you into an alt-right boy because there's a huge rise of like teenage boys these days becoming very alt-right especially in comparison to girls, like they're completely diverging
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And so, like I'm not here to make a judgment on the internet.
KAYLA: Here's what I will make a judgment on, in terms of like the sexualizing issue where it like, you know it feels like kids are like starting to think about dating earlier like starting to think about sex earlier, here's the problem, is that there is more information about sex and romance on the internet than ever
SARAH: Yeah, and there are more examples of what it could be
KAYLA: Yes, what has not changed is sex ed
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, you have these kids… correction, you have the kids that are on the internet who have all of this exposure to things but they don't have the proper education, then you have the kids who don't have as much internet exposure, their parents are more strict, they don't know anything, the other kids are telling them shit, they're getting a whack-ass sex education
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: It's like what do we expect to be happening, like, of course
SARAH: Yeah, and when we don't give kids a proper sex… like people think like, oh, like abstinence only, is the only way to go like don't ever talk about sex with a younger kid but then it's like, okay, if they're in a situation that's like dangerous to them they don't know how to react or if a predator is coming at them in their Instagram comments, they won't know it's bad
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like, they'll be like, “oh my God, this guy's giving me attention” like, “cool”
KAYLA: Yeah. I've also seen some people say like, oh, that's just like a rite of passage like on Omegle or on like Club Penguin DMs like I had… I was talking to weird men on like AOL... what was it called?
SARAH: AIM?
KAYLA: Yeah, on AIM, like we've all done that
SARAH: On AIM?
KAYLA: AIM
SARAH: I've never heard someone say it aim though
KAYLA: Oh, I don't know, I have, on AIM, I never heard, I never did on AIM
SARAH: I didn't hear, I was a little too young for that, yeah
KAYLA: Yeah. Anyway, so people are like, “oh it happens all the time” and it's like, okay, well, A, it shouldn't and B, I could guarantee it's happening a lot more now because there's like a trillion more kids on the internet than when we were younger like that's nothing
SARAH: Yeah, that doesn't mean anything at all. And then of course it's always like when the government is like, “actually, we should protect our children” they're going about it in like all the wrong ways
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: They're just like, “let's ban TikTok, that'll solve the problem”
KAYLA: Well, because the problem with like government sanctions and whatever is that they start putting like you know content warnings on things or whatever but then you start having like, queer content gets flagged and you have, you know, like it's… like, okay, that's a nice thought, I guess, but like it's not if you have the wrong people in power we're not… it's not going to happen
SARAH: At one point is it protecting kids and at what point is it censorship?
KAYLA: Yes, and I don't know
SARAH: And then also it's like, there has been discussion about this where it's like, you have to be however old to go on this website
KAYLA: Yeah
[00:30:00]
SARAH: Everyone knows you just lie, everyone knows that
KAYLA: Yes, it's… I mean it's protecting the liability of the website more than anything
SARAH: Right, and then if you're stupid enough to put your real age then they're like ha ha ha
KAYLA: Yeah, got you
SARAH: But there has now been like what they're trying to do with Pornhub in Texas and in some states is they want you to prove your age and upload your id and that is so dangerous
KAYLA: Yeah, like I get…
SARAH: I understand why
KAYLA: But also, now they have everyone's ID of who is looking at porn
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: And what porn they're looking at
SARAH: And what porn they're looking at
KAYLA: This is in Texas, like… yeah
SARAH: Yeah. And so, it's such a… because kids are… I don't know that kids are sexualized any younger than they always have been
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I think that sexualization has just become more normalized on the internet
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like people don't bat an eye at it as much as you would if you if… like if you saw a weird ass man making weird eyes at like a kid on the street you would be like, “what the fuck?” like get…
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like protect this child, but like, when you see it on the internet it's like first of all, “what can I do?”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: You're limited, it's not like in real life where you can like walk up to the guy and be like, “I'm going to slap you in the face”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And then also it's like, it just… it happens so often that I mean you can't intervene every time even if you want to
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So, I think it's not that kids are being sexualized younger, it's just that they have a broader access to more options of like what being a big kid looks like and that influences how they choose to act and how they choose to comport themselves as a young person
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: And then also just the fact that it has become more normalized, more common and so like people are always like, “oh, we're doomed, kids these days” and it's like, “well, it's not the fucking kid's fault”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like it's our fault
KAYLA: And I also think there is a certain aspect to it of like this happens every generation
SARAH: Oh, yes
KAYLA: Like not to say that like, “oh, it's fine this happens all the time” but like these things do happen, you know?
SARAH: And by these things we mean like kids trying to act older than they are
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: Not…
KAYLA: And just like the kids these days have it all
SARAH: Right
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: We're not saying, “well, all kids have pedos”
KAYLA: Yeah, no
SARAH: That’s what we’re saying
KAYLA: That's not what I was saying
SARAH: I just want to be clear
KAYLA: Thank you, yeah. I think that… just like what's interesting is you think about like within, I don't know, like the last 10 years the way social media has changed from like Facebook and Myspace I guess where like it was just your friends, it was not public and even I think Twitter started out that way, you know, like you didn't follow strangers on Twitter like…
SARAH: I remember when on Vine when revining became a thing I was so upset because I didn't care about the vines of people I didn't know
KAYLA: Yeah, you were like, “where's my friends?”
SARAH: I was like, “I don't want to see these”
KAYLA: Yeah, no, yes, so like you know, social media started off as, “these are your friends” and then slowly it became like you follow whoever and it's just like very public thing
SARAH: You follow famous people and then now you follow brands and now you follow, yeah
KAYLA: Yeah, so it just like gives adults a huge amount of access to kids where in the past like the adults that had access to you online were like people you knew in real life or like if adults were invading kids’ spaces
SARAH: Right
KAYLA: I also feel like… I mean, I guess you have like Roblox and Minecraft, that's not really an online thing but like there are still kids’ spaces but I feel like when we were younger there was like… And you know what? Maybe this is actually stupid because I'm not a kid so how would I fuck would I know where the kids are hanging out online
SARAH: Yeah, maybe they have a very cool place where all the kids go, maybe they have their Club Penguin
KAYLA: That's what I'm saying, like… I think that's Roblox, but there might be like a robust amount of like online spaces for children, but I feel like when we were growing up there was like… you had like the Nickelodeon games website and like the Barbie games…
SARAH: Yeah. You know the fucking ‘Sweet Love of Zach and Cody’ game? Where you had to go around the whole town?
KAYLA: It fucked so hard, it fucked so hard
SARAH: Oh, it's so good
KAYLA: Or even just like gaming consoles you know like the most you could do was like if you were on the bus playing with your friends on your DS and you could like connect them or whatever
SARAH: Yeah. Star-doll
KAYLA: I don't know her
SARAH: Where you put clothes on it, you just like, there's a doll and you put clothes on it
KAYLA: Yes, I liked the Tinkerbell Fairies games; those were great, but you know, like, there wasn't like, “I'm going to hop on COD as a nine-year-old and fight with some like 45-year-old creep,”
SARAH: Right
KAYLA: While we're killing people, you know?
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Like, it's just… there's unprecedented levels of access between generations at this point.
SARAH: Right. And this is not to say that this didn't happen in our generation because I will always use this delightful little example, back when you would just like upload videos on YouTube just like to have a record of them just for fun, when I was a kid, I had a friend who uploaded videos of us doing like acro, like acrobatic things at like a sleepover. And in one of the videos, they were like, “haha, look, Sarah has a six-pack,”
KAYLA: And she did. It's a wild six-pack
SARAH: The video, it's still there, I do believe.
KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: And then they posted it, and I was like, “oh haha, like it's just a video,” like the oldest people in that video were like maybe 13
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: They seemed so old at the time. But…
KAYLA: Of course
SARAH: And maybe 14, maybe. I was probably like 10
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: And I only found out several years later when I went back and been like, “I want to try and find that video,”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Then it had like 45,000 views and a bunch of creepy comments, primarily about me but also about some of the other people too because I didn't have boobs, but some of the other kids did.
KAYLA: Uh
SARAH: And there were some weird creepy comments that were like, “oh yeah, flex your muscle, like whatever.” And like by the time I saw that, I was far enough removed from it that I was like, “that's fucking weird”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like, I was glad I hadn't seen it when I was any younger.
KAYLA: Yeah, man
SARAH: And since then, the person who posted those videos turned off the comments
KAYLA: Good
SARAH: But that shit still happened, but I wasn't so plugged into the internet that I like, immediately saw all of those comments about me
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like it was like years later I saw it. And maybe if it had been my channel, I would have seen it sooner, but like it's just everything is… everyone is moving faster and breaking things faster
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: And kids have always been over-sexualized, and that's not even getting into any of this stuff of like pressuring kids into feeling like they need to have crushes and have sex and whatever, like that… we're not even getting into any of that
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Because that's a whole other thing
KAYLA: But that's also like unfortunately not new at all
SARAH: Yeah, that's not new at all, it's just I guess there are more… there's peer pressure from more places or pressure from more places than…
KAYLA: Well, I think it's like you have that pressure then on top of like seeing older people talk about dating and sex so much. So, like you already have people like, “oh my god, like who's your little crush,” and then you see adults online talking about their love life, and so then you're like, “well, the big kids are doing it, and my fucking mom keeps asking me who my crush is,” this is not hate on my mom, my mom never did that that I remember, I don't think she would have done that to me, anyway, then it just like makes the whole thing worse.
SARAH: Yeah, I saw a Reddit thing the other day of a father, of a kid; his kid was like 13 or 14, had had a girlfriend, was hanging out at his girlfriend's house.
KAYLA: Oh no
SARAH: The parents were there, he had met the mom of this girl before, and she was fine, he had never met the dad before, and the dad told them like, “oh, you have to leave the door open, however much,” and because they're like 13, they were like, “no”
KAYLA: Yeah, sure
SARAH: “I don't want to.”
KAYLA: 13, yeah, they're 13.
SARAH: So, they shut the door, and the dad got so mad that he stormed into the room and punched this 13-year-old boy in the face and then this kid calls his dad and is like, “I want to go home”
KAYLA: “I just got punched.”
SARAH: Well, he didn't even say anything about it at first; he was just like, “I want to go home.” And the dad was like, “oh, I'm surprised like you want to go home so early, but sure, yeah, I'll come pick you up.” And then he picked him up, and he was like, why do you have a fucking blood… like why do you have blood on your face? And like, it led to a whole discourse about like fathers thinking that they own their daughters and like whatever. And some people were like, “well, they shouldn't have shut the door,” it's like they're 13
KAYLA: They're literally 13, you cannot assault a child
SARAH: They're not always going to listen
KAYLA: You can't punch a child
SARAH: It doesn't matter. And then people were like, “well, he was saving his daughter from being sexually assaulted.” And I’m like, “what the fuck are you…”
KAYLA: How do you know that?
SARAH: “How are you jumping to conclusions like that?”
KAYLA: Yeah. Oh lord
SARAH: I don't remember why I brought that up
KAYLA: I don't either, that sucked.
SARAH: But parents have always been in kids' business, but now literally every other adult is also actively in kids' business because everyone can see kids' business because they put it on the internet.
[00:40:00]
KAYLA: Yeah, well, then you have like people telling other people how to parent because they can see all the kids' business, and it's just like it's a whole mess.
SARAH: Yeah, I do like dunking on bad parents online sometimes though.
KAYLA: Yeah, but like only if you're like for sure this is bad.
SARAH: Oh yeah, I saw a video recently where this woman was like, “I don't like swing sets with bright colors,” so she's like, “I don't want a green slide and a yellow swing,” so she made like…
KAYLA: Oh, sad bitch, baby
SARAH: It was like a sad bitch swing set but also it was definitely not structurally sound.
KAYLA: Oh, good
SARAH: And… because it was like two, I don't know, fucking two by eights or something going up and then like another one and like dangling off the edge, and there was… They were not like point… It wasn't like a triangle. Like, it was just…
KAYLA: Sure.
SARAH: And I was looking in the comments, and everyone was like… they were dunking on her about the fact that she didn't like swing sets with yellow slides. Um, but then also there are some people being like that is like dangerous, like that’s…
KAYLA: Yeah, and it's not up to code.
SARAH: And she responded, and she was like, “It's in six feet of concrete, it's fine.” And then the person was like, “Yeah, but like that's wood if they're…” because they're… like it will warp when they're on it
KAYLA: Yeah, the concrete is not going to save it from wood snapping in half.
SARAH: And she… it was just like, okay, I love liking comments when people are doing that crazy stuff. And my sister is very into following those family vloggers, not like in the way that she likes the videos, but like in the way that she likes to follow everything that's there, be… that they're being crazy about
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Which again is a whole other thing but… so, I... There is no really good conclusion to this, I guess just internet. Who would have thunk it? Internet dangerous
KAYLA: Who could have thought?
SARAH: Who could have thought? But also, internet can be good and kids sexualized more but not…
KAYLA: Bad
SARAH: Necessarily younger, maybe in some cases a little bit younger but I just…
KAYLA: It’s just more visibly I think
SARAH: It’s just more visible. It's just more like…
KAYLA: Because I don't even… I couldn't even begin to know if it's actually more, I haven't done the research but certainly more in front of everybody
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Brazen…
SARAH: Well, and because people can like hide behind the supposed anonymity of the internet
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Which may have been a little bit easier to do back in the earlier days of the internet than it is now
KAYLA: Not so much anymore
SARAH: But yeah, it's just all out there and I think that's why people have these moral panics where it's like we're doomed, kids these days, even if they're not blaming it on the kids, like if they're like, “Oh, like whatever,” it's just like everything is so visible and then… so, then you see it and then you react publicly and then people see you react publicly and then people… more people become aware of the original thing and they might not understand it properly and it's just like, you know, the internet
KAYLA: Yep
SARAH: The internet. Do you have anything else to say?
KAYLA: I'm really sweaty
SARAH: Okay. I don't think we came to any conclusions in this episode, just… but we said words.
KAYLA: I mean, it… I'll be honest, I think my prediction was wrong, it felt pretty like baseline the whole time, you know? I didn't start off being like, “This is shit,” and then I was like, “This is great,” the whole time I was like, “This is pretty okay podcast,”
SARAH: Nice
KAYLA: Pretty average stuff coming out
SARAH: I was just like, “Is this relating enough to asexuality?” Yeah, because it's about fucking sexualizing kids
KAYLA: I mean, at this point 302 episodes…
SARAH: And aspecs know.
KAYLA: It's like, you know, I don't think that's why anyone is here anymore
SARAH: As long as it's adjacent
KAYLA: Sure. And even if it's not, you know. The thing is, is it's always going to be two aspec people talking about it, so it's like…
SARAH: That's true
KAYLA: It could be anything
SARAH: Well, and… no, it started with me being too aspec because I was like, “How is this different from being mad about a 12-year-old?”
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: Because I like… in my brain, I was like, “these two things seem… to me”
KAYLA: Because you were like… And you were like, “That sounds fake but okay”
SARAH: Exactly
KAYLA: On a boom
SARAH: Full circle, okay, Kayla, what's our poll for this week?
KAYLA: Internet ruining everything, question mark
SARAH: Yeah. You know what? I do have an interesting question
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: Internet, net positive or net negative?
KAYLA: I have such deja vu right now, I swear we've asked that exact question before
SARAH: We'll fucking ask it again, Kayla
KAYLA: No, we will, we will for sure, but it's just funny, I just… it feels so familiar to me
SARAH: Like my instinct is like, I have to say net positive just because of like the communities and stuff that I see and I'm a part of but then I think about all the other things on the internet and like…
KAYLA: The thing is, I have to say net positive because if I think anything else I fear I will spiral into despair
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, I just have to convince myself that it's net positive
SARAH: Yeah, because then if you start thinking too much about like the manifestos of school shooters being spread online leading to more school shooting like…
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I was, I was listening to the podcast, ‘Behind the Bastards’ the other day where they were talking about this woman who was known as the nazi priestess who she fucking loved Hitler but she didn't like really get into nazism until after he died like after World War II and she just like wrote some crazy stuff and said some crazy stuff. Apparently, some of her books are like the basis of like environmentalism and the green party and so like there's a very dangerous… like the Venn diagram has a very dangerous overlap
KAYLA: Very bizarre
SARAH: Yeah, but it was interesting where they were talking about like the… they had a word for like how um extremist groups will use like very specific niche things like… not niche things but like environmentalism as like a gateway drug to neo-nazism and like how they will do that on purpose. Anyway, not the point, but they were just talking about how like up until, I don't know, the past 10-15 years, people would have seen her as like kind of a failure and getting the word out about, you know…
KAYLA: A word?
SARAH: What she stood for, about Hitler. But in the past 10 to 15 years, her stuff on the internet has really kind of taken off and gained new life. And like, they talk specifically, I think, that like the Christchurch shooter in New Zealand was like, they were able to link that person like directly to this woman's works. And like… it's just like, that's the fucking internet, baby.
KAYLA: It's bad. The list of content warnings I have written down just in the last, like, 10 minutes of this podcast.
SARAH: Sorry, things to say.
KAYLA: We will
SARAH: Okay, internet: net good or net bad?
KAYLA: Yeah, now that we've just said all that shit…
SARAH: You have to make a choice. You must.
KAYLA: I don't want to. I don't want to.
SARAH: I don't want to, but we both already did
KAYLA: I suppose.
SARAH: Anyway. Kayla, what's your beef and your juice for this week?
KAYLA: Oh, I mean, what isn't my beef, you know what I'm saying? Um, you don't, Sarah does, but you don't. Um, you know, anyway, my juice is, ooh, it's tough out here. Um, my juice is that my friend took me out to buy work clothes because I didn't have any anymore.
SARAH: Did you go to the mall like it was 2004?
KAYLA: We were going to, but then her car got towed that day so it delayed plans a little bit
SARAH: Oh, no
KAYLA: So, we went to like, basically an outdoor mall, just like, this very gentrified area of the city that's just…
SARAH: Classic
KAYLA: An outside mall at this point. Um, and we went to those places. Um, but she was a very efficient shopper. It felt like shopping with my mom, and she picked out everything for me and was just like, “Here you go,” uh, and we had a very successful time, and we went to all the outlets, so we got some great deals.
SARAH: You got some great deals. I love that for you
KAYLA: At the Banana Outlet.
SARAH: Ooh
KAYLA: I'm a Banana girly now, if you even care.
SARAH: I’ve never bought anything from Banana… in my whole life.
KAYLA: Well, it was funny because we initially didn't go to Banana because she was like, “I do not like Banana.” So, we went somewhere else, and that sucked. So, she was like, “Okay, I guess we'll try Banana,” and then we became Banana girlies.
SARAH: Banana girlies. Um…
KAYLA: Anyway
SARAH: When you just keep calling it Banana, it really like seems a little less prestigious
KAYLA: The Banana Republic. I mean, it's a store. I don't know that it's... it's not fucking Gucci.
SARAH: No, but you just calling it Banana repeatedly made it feel a little bit more like a JC Penney to me. I don't know.
KAYLA: Good. Did you see someone wore Gap to the Met Gala?
SARAH: Huh?
KAYLA: Apparently, Gap is like making a comeback.
SARAH: All right
KAYLA: Anyway
SARAH: My beef... Okay, my juice is I'm going on a Mother's Day trip with my family. My beef is that my grandma was supposed to go and can't because she's not allowed to fly right now because she's getting breathing treatments, and you're not supposed to get on a plane when you can't breathe right.
KAYLA: Yeah.
[00:50:00]
SARAH: My other beef is that the place we're going is Florida, which… look…
KAYLA: Period, that's all you had to say.
SARAH: The actual venue of where we're staying, very nice, it's a lovely place. But my mom sent a screenshot of the weather there, and I looked at the weather here, and I said, “I can't believe I'm leaving this for that.”
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Whereas my family, they're coming from Michigan, so they're like, “Oh my God, it's so much warmer, so much nicer,” whereas I'm like, “What do you mean it's 85 and humid?”
KAYLA: Yeah, I'm actually fine where I am. Thank you
SARAH: It's like 72 degrees and sunny right now. Like, I'm fine.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I really, knock on wood, but I really hope it does not get too hot soon. This year, the heat has been at bay so far.
KAYLA: Speak for your fucking self, God.
SARAH: Maybe in part because it keeps raining for some fucking reason
KAYLA: We had a lot of rain… anyway, it's not even that high, it's like in the 70s here, but I don't have air conditioning, and we haven't put in our window units yet, so, I…
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: It's nicer outside than it is in my house.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Unfortunately
SARAH: I'm just like, if it gets over 75, I'm like, “Stop it, fucking calm down.” Uh, but it's LA, baby, and it's May, which means pretty soon. He he he he. Um, all right, you can tell us about your beef, your juice… my other juice is I made a flat grandma of my grandma.
KAYLA: I saw it
SARAH: If you know Flat Stanley, you know.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I made Flat Grandma. Uh, she's coming with us. Oh, sorry, I'm sorry, it was way too loud, I'm like right there. Um, but she's coming with us on our journey. You can tell us about your beef, your juice, your thoughts on the virtues of the internet on our social media @SoundsFakePod. We also have a Patreon, patreon.com/soundsfakepod. We have some $5 patrons who we'd like to promote this week, and they are Ashley W, Boston Smith, Bronwyn Herron, Brooke Siegel, and Byron Rusnak. Our $10 patrons who we would like to promote this year, Mother's Day, are Martin Chiesl, who would like to promote his podcast Everyone’s Special and No One Is, Parker, who would like to promote being a silly little guy, Purple Hayes who would like to promote their friend's podcast The Host Club, Barefoot Backpacker who would like to promote their YouTube channel rtwbarefoot, SongOStorm who would like to promote a healthy work-life balance, and Val who would like to promote mothers, but also not becoming a mother if you don't want to become a mother.
KAYLA: Well, I think we should promote mothers in like the broad sense
SARAH: In the broad sense
KAYLA: You know, like, mother
SARAH: Mother, she's mothering
KAYLA: She's mothering
SARAH: Our other $10 patrons are Alyson, Ani, Arcnes, Benjamin Ybarra, Celina Dobson, David Harris, Derick & Carissa, Elle Bitter, my Aunt Jeannie, who is a mother, and Kayla's dad, who is not a mother, and Maff.
KAYLA: Nope.
SARAH: Our $15 patrons are Ace, who would like to promote the writer Crystal Scherer, Andrew Hillum who would like to promote the Invisible Special podcast, Dia Chappell who would like to promote Twitch.tv/MelodyDia, Hector Murillo, who would like to promote friends that are supportive, constructive, and help you grow as a better person, Nathaniel White, who would like to promote NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com, Kayla's Aunt Nina, who would like to promote katemaggartart.com and is a mother
KAYLA: She is a mother, she is a mother
SARAH: Schnell who would like to promote accepting that everyone is different and that's awesome. And our $20 patrons are Dragonfly and my mom, who is a mother, and they would like to promote beignets. Thanks for listening, tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your mother.
SARAH: If you haven't gotten your mother something for Mother's Day yet, real quick, real, real quick, do something.
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: Draw her her picture. Bye.
KAYLA: Yes, good.
[END OF TRANSCRIPT]
